tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post5596912107663091159..comments2023-09-14T01:03:30.922+01:00Comments on The Thirsty Gargoyle: The Cloyne Report: Tackling Prevailing MythsThe Thirsty Gargoylehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-72120612072181477622011-11-28T11:59:31.915+00:002011-11-28T11:59:31.915+00:00Just come across your article - a real tour de for...Just come across your article - a real tour de force. Glad I found it, and hope to follow you more.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-2986885804650098272011-09-07T12:24:29.814+01:002011-09-07T12:24:29.814+01:00I have looked at several different histories of th...I have looked at several different histories of the "Ireland in the Twentieth Century" type and can't find a single reference to John Cooney's claim that Archbishop McQuaid was a paedophile e.g. histories by Diarmaid Ferriter, Dermot Keogh, Tim Pat Coogan and others.It was Diarmaid Feriter I was thinking of re his "The Transformation of Ireland: 1900-2000" (published Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-61877702922288332542011-08-25T02:07:57.460+01:002011-08-25T02:07:57.460+01:00Hmmm.
Well, regarding your reluctance to accept ...Hmmm. <br /><br />Well, regarding your reluctance to accept the SAVI figures, I sympathise with your refusal to countenance the possibility that hundreds of thousands of Irish people had been sexually abused or even raped as children. It's a horrible scenario to contemplate, but I think it's almost certainly true. As it happens, <br /><br />Lalor and McElvaney's piece on written for The Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-60839490642302299892011-08-24T18:03:01.133+01:002011-08-24T18:03:01.133+01:00CONTINUED I have no idea just how common this type...CONTINUED I have no idea just how common this type of thing is in Ireland since no-one is funding studies about false allegations of rape or child abuse. However Katie Roiphe has a lot to say about the issue in the USA. For example:<br />She quotes Naomi Wolf writing in "The Beauty Myth" - "Cultural representation of glamorised degradation has created a situation among the young Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-49549603813312275192011-08-24T17:52:08.767+01:002011-08-24T17:52:08.767+01:00I suppose that "One in Four" takes its n...I suppose that "One in Four" takes its name from the American figure. It was first set up in the UK in 1999 - after the Taoiseach's apology to "survivors" in May of that year. There are about a dozen such groups and not a single one dates from before the time it became clear that large amounts of State funding were going to be on the table.<br /><br />I have a section on Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-52105728037360697662011-08-21T03:37:37.234+01:002011-08-21T03:37:37.234+01:00I agree that it is odd that there seems to have be...I agree that it is odd that there seems to have been no debate in the Dail on the matter, especially given how the Study's findings were officially launched by President McAleese in Dublin Castle, but think this is probably because the problem is too big, such that it's beyond the State's powers to resolve. Perhaps the simplest thing for you to do, though, would be to write to the The Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-40179056781182518792011-08-21T03:37:19.255+01:002011-08-21T03:37:19.255+01:00Okay, so in short, you don't believe it. Fair ...Okay, so in short, you don't believe it. Fair enough. I expect that's what many of our politicians did at the time the Study was published. Sometimes it's easier to ignore reality than to face it. For what it's worth, I don't see that your American figures are in any way comparable to the SAVI ones, not least because they represent a retroactive taxonomic interpretation of The Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-18274955291280434702011-08-20T23:59:57.428+01:002011-08-20T23:59:57.428+01:00I find it incredible that 27 percent of Irish adul...I find it incredible that 27 percent of Irish adults in 2001 had been the vicims of child sexual abuse - especially in view of the fact that 48 per cent said they had never told anybody before and only 5 percent had reported the abuse to the Gardai. You pointed out previously that according to the 2002 census there were 2,904,172 adults in Ireland the year after the SAVI Study was conducted. Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/16315245582069674422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-85060114824630224822011-08-15T23:34:10.532+01:002011-08-15T23:34:10.532+01:00I've already read the very small part of Webst...I've already read the very small part of Webster's work relating to Ireland -- just a few pages in a huge tome that looks fantastic but that's all well beyond my budget. His points are good, but in terms of Ireland they don't really reveal anything at all about the broad problem.<br /><br />You might be right on Irish historians, but it seems to me that as yet the data's stillThe Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-83765723161833096082011-08-15T23:18:13.234+01:002011-08-15T23:18:13.234+01:00We are never going to agree on this. No Irish hist...We are never going to agree on this. No Irish historian has done a serious study on false allegations of child abuse but UK cultural historian Richard Webster (who died recently) has done so. Most of his work was naturally concentrated on the UK but he included a section on Ireland in his 2005 book "The Secret of Bryn Estyn: The Making of a Modern Witch Hunt".<br /><br />After his Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-39146261154571150182011-08-15T15:55:57.000+01:002011-08-15T15:55:57.000+01:00I take all your points, Rory, but without studying...I take all your points, Rory, but without studying the evidence myself, I'm staying agnostic. <br /> <br />I don't think ad hominem attacks on prominent self-appointed spokespeople for abuse survivors says anything, really, about the reality of abuse as a phenomenon. It really looks as though it's endemic in Irish society. <br /><br />I do believe the SAVI figures, because a sample ofThe Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-71145010687053684112011-08-15T15:31:05.494+01:002011-08-15T15:31:05.494+01:00Yes the statistics about the Irish Times use of &q...Yes the statistics about the Irish Times use of "paedophile priests" probably came from the SAVI Report. However it is one of the few things I would accept about SAVI (more later on this).<br /><br />It is my opinion that the vast majority of child abuse allegations against clergy and religious are false. I pointed out that the leaders of FOUR "Victims" groups made Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-72997391736247704472011-08-12T08:39:46.638+01:002011-08-12T08:39:46.638+01:00I see your point, but I think I'd have to disa...I see your point, but I think I'd have to disagree with you.<br /><br />I believe the SAVI figures, more or less. Priests had an all-too-easily abused prestige then, and an astonishing degree of access to children, and it's very clear that many unsuitable people had been pushed into the priesthood.<br /><br />To be honest, given the opportunities and the prevalance of abuse in wider IrishThe Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-58172558525473579952011-08-12T06:30:45.170+01:002011-08-12T06:30:45.170+01:00I will comment elsewhere about the SAVI study but ...I will comment elsewhere about the SAVI study but I think it is clear that the vast majority of the allegations of child abuse are false. <br /><br />As I pointed out on my website www.irishsalem.com leading members of FOUR "Victims" groups have made allegations that the Christian Brothers and the Sisters of Mercy deliberately killed children in their care (and we are NOT talking about Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-83103633399692237612011-08-05T05:30:06.152+01:002011-08-05T05:30:06.152+01:00Thank you for that; it's very kind of you.
I&...Thank you for that; it's very kind of you.<br /><br />I've had a look at your site, and think you may well be onto something in your belief that serious false accusations made about Magee in the 1990s could have prejudiced him against dealing seriously with allegations against his priests; certainly I've yet to come across any other explanations for his demonstrable lack of interest The Thirsty Gargoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07555762505933950270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-11911881894628039922011-08-04T22:35:45.423+01:002011-08-04T22:35:45.423+01:00I published the following summary of Garda investi...I published the following summary of Garda investigations into Cloyne on a number of websites:<br /><br />I am wondering what precisely all the fuss is about? For several years now the Gardai have been investigating claims of child abuse in the Cloyne Diocese and the following is the result:<br /><br />An allegation of reckless endangerment against former Bishop Magee was dismissed by the Kilbarry1https://www.blogger.com/profile/05772216909062541582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-52805779780975790242011-08-02T13:24:39.377+01:002011-08-02T13:24:39.377+01:00Excellent, TG!
Clear and unequivocal. Might you c...Excellent, TG!<br /><br />Clear and unequivocal. Might you consider teaching a class in journalism? I can think of a few columnists and newspapers that could benefit from it...GORhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14313101159848740722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-80931025346942639592011-07-31T16:47:26.230+01:002011-07-31T16:47:26.230+01:00I have no time for the organs of the RC church but...I have no time for the organs of the RC church but I think this cheap demagoguery by Enda Kenny will eventually be seen for what it is. <br /><br />He simply decided, in a cynical way, to ride the zeitgeist. It feels, in a way I suppose, like a symbolic act of casting away the chains and weight the church's influence seems to have represented to many. Much of what it contained was overdue andAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-2612171763987266872011-07-31T16:38:37.072+01:002011-07-31T16:38:37.072+01:00Great, succinct piece of writing. Keep it up (and ...Great, succinct piece of writing. Keep it up (and write that book!).Gavanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07914578323548304435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-52015803109917811402011-07-31T15:53:14.131+01:002011-07-31T15:53:14.131+01:00You are a hidden weapon in the Lord's quiver. ...You are a hidden weapon in the Lord's quiver. Thank you for the time you took to research, cite, and write. Blessings.Carolenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-200177861013445343.post-24843357341951438702011-07-30T20:26:01.269+01:002011-07-30T20:26:01.269+01:00Way to go. I look forward to the book. - ASWay to go. I look forward to the book. - ASAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com